Leaderboard

At this point, it's almost irrelevant, because I spent two hours trying to get online last night and being error-coded into oblivion, sometimes, with two separate error codes/messages in the same attempt. Zero issues with other games. When Friday the 13th: The Game has a more consistent online matchmaking system than you do, you're doing it wrong.

If you are playing on PS4 and get griefed, when you respawn immediately crouch so that your griefer cannot see you. Pull up the player list with your left directional button. Locate the griefer on the list and click on them. Choose the option to see their PSN profile. Once there, choose the "..." option at the right and click on "Block". Log out and log back into the game. You will never see that player ever again. I did that on the first two days of playing. I blocked about 10 people. Now I am on servers without any di*ks, I have been playing all day today -- everyone is cool. The PvP griefers are a tiny asinine minority. At least so far, until R* puts in a more concrete way to deal with them like private lobbies, this method at least eliminates the griefers after one event with you. Like I said, after a couple of days and about 10 griefers getting blocked, I've been able to play peacefully all day today without anyone causing me any problems. I've had plenty of folks in my vicinity, but since I've been blocking the "must kill evah thing ah see" crowd, all of my fellow players have been peaceful and considerate.

I made a suggestion to R* that we be able to wear our vests unbuttoned open like a lot of the famous movie cowboys such as John Wayne or James Arness as Marshal Dillon anyone else down for that??

I hadn't done anything with other players, so I decided to check out the "Posse Up" option, and got thrown into a random group. Grabbed my headset and hoped for the best, not expecting much. I must have gotten lucky, because it turned out to be a great group, all friendly and on-mic. We did some story and stranger missions, got into a few shoot-outs, and swapped war stories for a few hours. Made some new Xbox friends, and had an overall great time. Just posting for those who don't have any friends who regularly play, and who don't expect much from randos. Go ahead and jump in... you never know!

Pics or it didn't happen.

My new policy is to largely ignore the grind and play for fun. Easier to say than do, though. Sure, I'll still hunt and sell etc - but only so long as it is fun. I'll hunt for a bit, fish for a bit, then do something else. I wont keep pace with the dedicated farmers and grinders, but so what? So long as i play enough to just about make sure I'm not totally over-powered in the death matches I'll cool with it. Glitches are tempting, but if boring, why bother? It's not so much a moral issue for me, as just a I want to play to have fun issue.

Theres no real easy or quick way to make money afaik. It's very grindy. But given the level locks, and that you only really need a very few items to get the most out of the game, it's probably better to just play and have fun and get money 'naturally'. I suspect that if you try and do hour after hour of grinding (whether hunting endless birds, or fishing salmon, or whatever) you'll get bored pretty quick. What do you really need: horse, varmint rifle, bow, fishing rod, shotgun. And if you have UE you already have 3 of those.

Last night a friend and I was out hunting by Fort Mercer. Having some fun and at one point we are chasing a deer and we chase it over a hill. As we go after there was another player and he immediately shoots and kills my friend with one shot. I hit him with a couple of shots to the head and claim our deer. My friend arrives and the other player shows back up and starts shooting at us again. We dispose of him quick cause we was ready for him. We head into Fort Mercer planning on this to blow over so we can get back to hunting. The players start coming in one at a time trying to get us. Each time we kill them and then the next and so forth. Before we know there ends up a dozen or so players outside trying to get to us. At this point I haven't died and my buddy has died only once. Others had died several times, location and cover and help a lot. So why are trying to figure out a plan on how to get out of this, some of them start fighting outside. So we just ride out and leave them to it. We kept playing for about an hour after that and the action was pretty non-stop there the whole time. I don't even know if they ever realized we even left. hahahaha

Co-worker and I were discussing this, I thought it was pretty interesting. Going off the timeline of RDR happening in 1911, and RDR2 about 12 years previous puts RDR2 in 1899. Here's what else was happening in America, and around the world at the time. US- William McKinley was president Queens & Staten Island merge with NYC Peace treaty from the Spanish-American war is ratified Great Blizzard happened in February, practically destroying Florida's citrus industry Mount Rainer National Park is established in Washington State Harriman starts the Alaska Expedition New Richmond, Wisconsin decimated by a tornado, 117 dead, over 200 others injured. Henry Bliss is the first automotive fatality in September, in NYC. Struck by an electic powered taxi, crushing his head and chest, as he exited a street car. Gunslinger and outlaw activity elsewhere in the wild west - Unforunately some of the more famous outlaws and gunslingers were dead by this time. But there were a few still raising hell along with Dutch's gang Wild Bill Hickok 1837-1876 Billy the Kid 1859-1881 John Wesley Hardin 1853 - 1895 Wyatt Earp 1848-1929 - Earp was mostly retired and living in San Francisco at the time of RDR2, (OK Corral happened in 1881) he was mostly an investor, investing in mines in Idaho and Colorado, and a consultant for silent cowboy movies, he was hired as a bounty hunter by LAPD in 1910 as his last official police position Butch Cassidy 1866 - 1908 - Butch was still active during the time of RDR2. He was imprissoned in 1894, and when he was released about 18 months later in 1896, he formed the Wild Bunch gang. They robbed the Union Pacific Overland Flyer in Wyoming June 1899. He tried to get Utah to give him amnesty when Utah became a state in 1896 but was declined. He then robbed another Union Pacific train in 1900, also in Wyoming. Butch then fled to South America in 1901, where he was believed to have robbed a bank in Argentina's Rio Gallegos. His death is uncertain, following a shootout with three soldiers of the Bolivian Army and local law it's believed Butch shot his partner Longabaugh in the forehead to put him out of his misery (they had numerous gunshot wounds to the lower body) before shooting himself in the temple. Doc Holliday 1851-1887 Kid Curry (Harvey Logan, a member of Butch Cassidy's Wild Bunch) 1867 - 1904 Elsewhere in the world - Australian colony leaders met to discuss creating a confederation and Canberra was named the capital of Australia. Also in Australia, Cyclon Mahina landed in Queensland, killing over 300. Boer War began in South Africa Finland's resistance to Russian tsar rule starts Terrorism (as we call it now) started in China, technically they're nationalists dubbed Boxers. Slogan Protect the country and Destroy the foreigner was shown in many streets. Majority were religious fanatics that feared the christian movement. Chinese gov. backed them. And, of course, it's the end of the 19th century.

Sounds good to me although I'd say leave them lit up for a few minutes . .....or maybe within a certain perimeter from where the offense occurred forcing them to leave the area or prepare to defend themselves. With the bounty you mentioned of course. What about allowing one posse to play the part of marshalls that can perhaps spawn in to the region where an offense takes place? ....but knowing trolls, they'll likely infiltrate that mechanic and it would backfire.

I simply don't enjoy being a walking billboard for a some company. If you think about it, it's the greatest con ever conceived: a clothing or apparel company has tricked consumers into PAYING THEM for the opportunity to wear conspicuously branded clothing and advertising said company or product. I'm as big of a W**** as there is, but I need to GET PAID if I'm going to sell a piece of my body, let alone my soul. If some superstar athlete/entertainer/performer wants to be paid to push a product, I don't judge them one bit. But to me, it's ludicrous that we, as consumers, pay top dollar for branded/badged clothing and accessories. I'm a good 6'4", and it's impossible for me to find pants that have a reasonable waist size (not everyone over 6' tall has a 40-in waist) matched to a proper inseam. I don't care if the pants are made by children's hands in a Malaysian sweatshop by Jacobean Mugatu, if it fits and I can hid the badge with a belt or remove it myself, I'm buying it. Unless they're yellow. I'll tolerate a lot of things, but yellow clothing isn't one of them. This isn't Zorro, the Gay Blade, this is real life, dammit. And yes, ZTGB is a real film:

In a PvEvP Enviroment, not all players are wanting to PvP. Yet they are on the map for all to see and nowhere to go and hide. Think we all know not all PvP players are actually looking for PvP. They want easy kills and then run away till you get tired of chasing them.

That is why I am still in Chapter 3 and doing as many of the side tasks as I can. Everytime I go to camp Dutch is in his tent," Arthur, we need to talk!" and I just walk on by.

Another good tip I've just discovered, small alligator skins sell for the same price as large ones ($3.50) but with the small ones you can stack under large carcasses

Ah, the wonders of Beta. I've always been dubious as to the way the "Wanted" system worked in both the story and online. Most of the time, it makes sense, but the definitely not random confluence of events I've experienced definitely makes for an inconsistent gaming experience at best, and is borderline unplayable at worst. It reminds me of the old "Rogue Agent" system in The Division. Experienced players/trolls would intentionally jump into the line of fire of a scoped player just to get nicked enough to have the unaware player labeled as "Rogue"--targeted on everyone's minimap, and turning them into a target. Realistically, that's how RDR2O should probably function: no minimap blips unless you have line-of-sight on another player, you hear gunfire (similar to the white blips in story mode), or they're Wanted for killing another player. That would do a lot to discourage senseless killing of other players; knowing you had a target on your back and stuck out like a sore thumb. And to remove it should cost Gold, unless you're killed. Maybe offer gold rewards in exchange for killing or turning in a Wanted player. Sure, it could be exploited to farm gold, but there could also be a cooldown period of 24 hours. After the first time a player is killed or captured after being Wanted, there isn't a gold reward for turning them in for another 24 hours. this would limit exploiting/farming.

I was bored hunting and went to rob the train as it passed though Bacchus Station. Not a good idea, well for the horse anyway. Stupid horse followed along side the train like it always does, right off the edge of the cliff. So if you're going to rob the train and Bacchus, bring a horse you don't care about losing

Got myself to chapter 6. I think I'm at 71% now. I think I'm at about 7 days spent playing... It's pretty much all Ive done on the weekends lol I may get back to the challenges soon, but I wanted to get through more of the story before I got sucked into online play. I mostly need to work on hunting requests and exotics. Everything else is either done, or inaccessible right now. I feel like now that I don't need to kill cougars for pelts or challenges, they attack me all the time... The satchel has proven to be very helpful though, you'll appreciate having it when you choose to continue on. Hell, I cooked/crafted a bunch of stuff way back in chapter 3 and I still haven't had to do so again. It's great for passive income too (not that you really need money). Go kill sh*t for a while and before you know it you have a few hundred in just meat. I always skin things when I kill them. I've had too many animals rot because I got distracted.

One would think quitting triggers it...

Totally get that. I'd rather play with RL friends too, but none of my friends are playing RDR.

Sounds like we need to catch each other online. Go have some fun.

I dont mind limited MTs. You know, pay a few quid for some cool cosmetics or what not. Or even some cash for extra DLC content (I did buy UE after all). Or even to get things a little bit quicker than most. Fair enough. But paying a lot of real cash for major advantage weaponry, horses, equipment, or even for sole access to stuff, or to get stuff massively quicker than others ... Seems a bit tawdry imho. Still, businesses gonna business.

For you my friend, Rockstar can sell you just 10 golden nuggets for only $99.99. Now friend don't shake your head. You do this 100 times, then you my friend can be able to turn in all those golden nuggets for one useless digital artifact that is completely useless outside the game. hehehehe I hate those microtransactions.

This weekend, every group I was with. We would ride to go do something and ended up after a few minutes that stopped and we did other things. I noticed after hunting a certain area animal spawns would slow way down. So we traveled and hunted, I'm not high enough to fish yet. We did missions, killed bad people, killed bad animals, robbed bad businesses. Just in case you haven't noticed everything we did we cause we was the good guys and they was bad. The bounties was just fake news.

Whatever you do, I repeat Do Not Do With The Buffalo. Instead of killing them, you will just kick them. They don't seem to appreciate that much. Just saying for a friend, who did it twice.

Right we can wear boots under/over pants collars unbuttoned or buttoned shirt sleeves up or down so why can’t we wear our vests unbuttoned.. I just wanna do this.

Actually i turned into an idiot last night.. But it was not the intention. I was hunting ducks at the lake, and i see a red dot approaching. I ran up hil in some bushes, and i saw that he was now at the spot at the lake, where i was, he looked up to me with his gun drawn, and i shot him..... Poor guy was trying to kill the bear that 3 seconds later killed me. I feel so bad!!!!! 😱

Sorry. Yes, I read your whole post. Yes, I read that your gun disappeared. I've played two characters to above level 15 and never had that happen. At the end of the day though, you want exploits. If you don't like the way the game is, wait till it releases, don't play the beta. Oh and don't try to act high and mighty when you are sitting there saying "Hey guys, how do I cheat? But don't judge me, yo."

You restrict theirs or they restrict yours. PvP should be an option between at least players who both consent. It shouldn't be a player trying to do one thing while another decides to shoot them in the back, cause it is only fun for one of them.

@McLawDiz great points, I agree 100%. Everyone who responded had good points actually. Just to put in my two cents in addition to everyone else's suggestions .... (although some may have already been mentioned in this thread), my main concerns are... - Definitely get rid of the pink dots, maybe have an option to only see pink blips If those people are in your Posse or something. - Take the gamer ID logo hovering above my head. Again, maybe make it optional for those who want it, but I personally don't want to hide behind a rock when someone is chasing me down, and they know where I am because it says my username above my head. It's stupid get rid of it. Wouldn't it be nice to ride by someone, and not know if they were an NPC or not? - Stop moving my damn camp. I logged on yesterday, a million miles from my camp. It took me 20 minutes to get there, because I had to work my way around all those groups of three or four people who were evidently going to ambush me as the waypoint went right by them. As a result, I got literally 10 seconds away from arriving, and Cripps moved my Camp from Blackwater somewhere near the swamps. I don't need a babysitter. Let me move my camp where I want and when I want. - Bring in a better bounty system. If someone shoots you, put a hefty bounty on them, and make it available for other players to collect the bounty if they can get there before the law does. And if they don't have the money to pay it, implement a system where they have to spend a certain amount of time in jail or something . And maybe make it impossible for them to see you after you respawn for five minutes or something, so they can't just keep shooting you as soon as you respawn. - As several people mentioned in other posts as well, don't charge $1.50 for a can of beans and only give $1.00 or something for a gold wedding band. It doesn't make sense. Keep the same economy/prices as single player for buying and selling, I think that would be a big Improvement. - Have some missions that are available to do solo... I miss the original RDR where you could choose from a dozen or so gang hideouts and just go do them by yourself. Why are all the missions 2 to 4 players? Again, this is probably just a repeat of several other people's complaints. I have only put about 7 hours into online play, and I have not been shot yet... But I know it's coming. I've just been playing very conservatively, and sticking close to my camp and just doing some hunting and stuff nearby . I mean, what fun is that? Having to stay within 100 yards of your camp because of griefers? I have ridden by several players and just got very very lucky not being shot yet. I literally have not really had very much fun with this, because I'm just worried about getting ambushed. I've done two or three missions and got paid what I consider to be chump change. Not even worth the ammo I used. I know for a fact I have to join a posse which I'm looking for right now. These are just my main concerns... I have a ton of other ones that I won't list, just basic ones as already mentioned, like changing appearances and side missions and stuff would be a lot of fun. Hopefully Rockstar listen to the players opinions and take it into account. Until I find a posse, I don't know that I will be spending much time with the online. I have a feeling everything will be reset when beta is over and the full launch starts. Who knows? LOL

Oh and go on the defense and kill them first? Hmmm wow I would’ve never thought of that! What a great idea cuz you can totally kill 3 guys and get to the mission start point before they respawn and come back! Wow I must be an idiot for not thinking of that before! Why don’t you try it and come back and tell me how it works out for you. Id bet money you get 2 of 3 down and then those will have respawned by time you get the 3rd down then your in the same predicament that you were before you started. And MAYBE I’m bored with single player. I have a million dollars and nothing else to buy or unlock so I’m sorry I enjoy the idea of creating a character and actually having sh*t to work for and unlock now! But hey guys I guess all of us that are like me and hate trolls have to stop playing cuz this dudes obviously from R* and has all the answers and he says not to play the game anymore if we don’t like the idiots that aren’t even playing right.

So today I get the on-line beta .... first part of it fine ... However the instant I go into Blackwater on free roam, immediate idiot fest...... Two little fools seperately attack me and kill me... because I am not even paying them attention. Why would I? This is why I NEVER play on-line, this is why i never payed GTA5 on line or COD on line or anything else on line...... If I wanted to mix with moronic idiots then I would go out and find some ... So unless Rockstar or whomever find some way to shut down the pond life... Then no thanks, not for me. If these puerile little ****s wish to fight there should be a process... a process in which I can refuse... Indeed there should be a menu choice which says "No interaction whatsoever with any other live player with an IQ below 140" That's my opinion and frankly I care less what anyone else thinks because I do not have the wiring to care.

Since hunting seems to be the best way to earn money in the game so far, I figured we should start a thread for newer players who are looking to earn some quick cash. Below are some tips that I've come up with after several days of doing nothing but bagging every animal I can see: Animals in Red Dead 2 have different quality pelts, and the better the quality the more money you can make. The kinds of pelts you can encounter are Perfect (***), Good (**), and Poor (*) Animals spawn randomly throughout the map, but my favorite places so far are Great Plains (Buffalo spawn there), Tall Trees, Blackbone Forest, and the Heartlands. The area between Valentine and Emerald Ranch seems to be a great spot because of how open it is. MAKE EVERY SHOT COUNT! If you riddle an animal with bullets the value of their pelt will decrease. If the animal is big enough try aiming for the head. When first starting out bag as many animals as you can, but as you start to earn more money and become a better hunter try going exclusively for "good" or "perfect" pelts since they will net a bigger profit. Your starting weapons are not great for hunting, so try and invest in some better firepower as soon as you can. The best all-around weapon for hunting is the Bolt Action Rifle, while the Varmint Rifle is good for small animals and even birds. The bow is also a good investment because it allows you to stealthily kill an animal without alerting any that are nearby. On the subject of weapons, keep in mind that if you shoot small animals with a large caliber weapon (e.g. the Bolt Action) it will reduce the value of their pelts. Bird hunting can be extremely profitable. Since most birds travel in flocks of two or more there is serious potential to earn a lot of cash by shooting down as many birds as you can. The Varmint Rifle or a repeater are your best options for taking down birds. The Baits (Herbivore Bait and Predator Bait) that you can buy in stores or craft aren't a great investment in my opinion. I've tried to use both on several occasions and either it won't work or only one or two animals will appear. I find it easier to hunt without it. If you kill a large animal (Buffalo, Bear, Elk, Moose, etc.) you are only allowed to carry one of their pelts at a time, so I suggest storing only the best quality pelt you can get. If you shoot an animal and it is dying, wait for it to bleed out. If you shoot it again the value of its pelt will decrease. When encountering a pack of animals, don't ride and/or run right into them. They'll likely hear you coming and disperse. Instead, hang back a bit and scout out the ones with good quality pelts. When you've found the best one, take it out first, and then go for as many others as you can. The bow is probably the best option for hunting packs of animals because of how quiet it is. Be careful of trolls. If they kill you you will lose your pelts that you've stored on your horse. Please feel free to add your own tips/advice to this thread!

Very long rant ahead 😂 First let me start by saying I love the game. Single player isn’t lacking stuff to do and online is honestly a lot better than I expected but honestly I’ll tell ya my 2 biggest issues with RDO. Trolls. And lack of good paying jobs. I completely understand that the game is meant for you have a posse and run around like a boss but it gets annoying quick when I’m trying to go into a town to do a mission and there’s a posse just camping there by the mission waiting to kill me everytime I try to come up to it so I just get killed over and over again. Also one of the free roam games is called archery master or something like that and the whole point is to run around shooting these targets with your bow and arrow and you get points by accuracy and distance from target. The game has nothing to do with killing eachother yet everytime I play it there’s like 30 players doing it and maybe 5 people are playing the game. The other 25 are running around with shotguns like it’s a deathmatch just killing everyone and it’s really really annoying. There’s literally a death match mode for that so wtf. Then not only that but I deal with that for the 10-15 minutes the game lasts and all I get is 1 gold nugget and like a dollar 50🙄 which brings me to my next point. The lack of good money/gold. Just like gta online the prices of everything are outrageous and the pay for games and missions are at the minimum forcing me to do one of 2 things. Either use real money and do microtransactions once those are available or quit my job so I can play the game 40 hours a week for weeks on end so I can buy a damn hat or something. I’m all for working for the money I don’t want it handed to me in one mission. BUT I shouldn’t have to no life for 3 days just to make 100 bucks and that won’t even buy me anything except food and ammo..

Shirts are buttoned all the way to the eye brows, yeah I can see the vest is a major issue.

That's exactly why I never bothered with that gold bar exploit in story mode. It makes a large part of the game entirely pointless. Now I have 10 gold bars PLUS 2k on top of that and nothing to spend it on... Point is, you'll get there one way or another. You'd might as well enjoy the ride. This is just a game after all, if you're not enjoying it then you shouldn't bother.

That's just ****ing embarrassing... I only had that one error at the end of a mission, but I also never tried getting back on... I thought that was how it worked, then I read @YodaMan 3D's post... Are you sure you blocked the person? I sometimes forget to after reporting them, could that be the case?

Well, if it's any consolation, I saw the following in a Tweet this weekend from R*. I am sure they've been receiving a ton of complaints about the lack of invite-only sessions, trolls, etc. .....and this response (IMO) likely came as a result of that and the complaints about the economy: Good on you for submitting your feedback. I've read the responses to the R* tweet and what folks have been saying on various social media. It seems (to me) the biggest complaints are what you brought up (lack of session options) and the in-game economy.

Finally, some one who understands. heehehehe. Thanks Truth for your support.

I got everything setup, and I can definitely see the difference. I can't say that it's displaying in 4k hdr like it says it should, but it definitely looks better than it did before I set it up. I simply don't have much to compare it with. Maybe I'll try it on AC origins at some point. That's probably the only other game I would expect to look "enhanced". Edit: There's no need for that man... Some of us just don't have all that much experience with this fancy technology.

Guess I lucked out. I chose to do the missions rather than grind out cash. I did a few before the game booted me at the end of one. Figured it was a sign I should get back to the story.

Ye you are probably true. The only reason is they are just assholes.

Maybe it makes them feel better. Let them compensate their life failure in game at least 🙂 or they are simply being morons.

Yet later in the game, you can clean your horse and afterwards you will have all those pelts reappear. At one point hunting, we got ambused and I died. When my horse returned it had no pelts. When hunted new ones, went and sold everything, went back to the horse and there was more pelts. Went back and sold those. I think sometimes the game gets overwhelmed and they temporarily disappear and then at some point they reappear. I know someone who reported this to Rockstar.

You need to buy a percolator from the store, once you have it you get an option by any fire to "pour". As for the ingredients if it's an item request just press LT/L2 then "give request", otherwise just sell it to him at camp.

Thanks. I already knew about the mute option and had to use it on several players. We also reported about 4 trolls who were using racial slurs and abusive language. Anyone who thinks this kind of online experience is ok needs to have the head examined. It got to the point that our team of 4 went to PSN party chat. This is textbook trolling. I know new session options are likely on the horizon but I hope they implement them sooner than later because if it takes too long there will only be this toxic element left playing in this game. At this point, I am even advocating for passive modes simply so players can navigate past the constant, hostile actions of these griefers. Currently, the best bet is to travel in packs and avoid others when possible which is hard when they cap mission points, etc. We still had a lot of fun but also several frustrating moments. When you fight back, they simply respawn again and continue their assault. .....there's no end unless you run away.

I feel you mate! I deal with the same problems! My biggest concern, even knowing its a beta, is the MASSIVE "Trolling / Griefing" that there is.. I try to be kind to everyone i meet, and i always end up getting shot. It takes away the fun. (For me atleast) i know there is some PVP people, loving the fact, that they can shoot everyone, without any reason.. But for me = No go! The prices is insane, its absurd how much things cost, and how slow the money earnings take.. Remember to report these thoughts on the feedback form Rockstar provided!

Okay. Translation: "My experience will be ruined if they listen to feedback". Translation: "My rights! MY RIGHTS!!!" What about the rights of others? Being constantly killed by a group of people when you are just trying to enjoy the online mode will do more to "kill all incentive to do missions or hunt or whatever" than having passive mode enabled. Enabling passive mode in a PvP environment literally would remove the ability to be griefed, that's it. So unless you're advocating for the ability to grief people, there's no reason to argue against passive mode. And don't feed me your recycled line about "enjoying having to watch my back"--it's disingenuous. Nobody is forcing you, personally, to enable passive mode, so having it available in a PvP setting literally does nothing to your personal experience with the game. Everything you're advocating is about enabling elitist trolling behavior, and no amount of spin or linguistic window dressing is going to change that. "forced upon" you, like a victim? Nobody is ignoring your point, we're just calling out the logical fallacies within your arguments, and the contradictory nature of everything you've said. And claiming to be "ignored" is a classic victim move. So now, you claim to be a victim of being misunderstood or misinterpreted? Ooooh, and yet another "normie" blast, (while calling it "dumb" to boot) and is that another victim statement, implying you'd become a victim of an uneven playing field if people could be passive? Oh, and is that another "watching their backs" reference? Your argument fails on multiple levels. Again, selective passive mode does nothing to impugn your enjoyment of having to "watch your back" if you opt to not activate that feature. There's no reason the two can't be on the same server, unless you're advocating for the ability to indiscriminately kill other players whenever you choose. You're beating around the bush and refusing to acknowledge your elitist desires. You want the prestige and glamour of ranking up on a full-pvp server so you can say, with pride, "I'm 1337 wtfpewpewgitgudnoob" Certified!!!! That's literally the only other reason to advocate your position, if, as you claim, it's not about being able to indiscriminately murder whomever you want whenever you'd like.

You seem to think this game is all about grinding.. While its just one aspect of the game Myself and friend where just hunting yesterday to stock up on food. In comes a four person posse and starts killing us. So we started killing them back. Basically we slaughtered each other over and over again, for over an hour. We actually tried to leave the area after 20 mins, but they killed our horses. After out horses got merked we decided to just keep killing them. Now.. we actually enjoy killing players (hate the auto aim tho).. But we stuck around for that one hour battle. People who don't care for pvp would probably have had to quit the lobby. Forcing pvp on to players who have no interest in it... isn't fun for non pvp folks.

Ehm... What? - So you are one of those actually finding it fun to spawn kill everyone moving? I agree with the poster of this. - The biggest problem is all the GTA Snotnoses running around ruining it for everyone!

Still can’t beat this one