My final review. Feel free to roast me.

[Aimesleje]

So… I’ve almost 100 percent-ed the game. And here’s my honest spoiler free analysis. Feel free to tell me if you think I’m being unfair.

Positives:
The story and acting is phenomenal
The world looks phenomenal
The bounty missions were very enjoyable but there were far too few of them
The hair growth system was cool to see


Negatives:
The economy is a joke
The morality system is a joke
The body weight system is a joke
The cleanliness and bath system is a joke
The side games are a joke. Games can’t be played for big bucks, even in Saint Denis
The camp is a joke!

Chores don’t get you any rewards or special dialogue, NPC’s don’t actually talk to you, and hunting for perfect pelts for upgrades is a complete waste of time because all the camp upgrades will disappear after chapter 6. (I learned that the hard way — and boy was I pissed)

The legendary animals and fish are a joke. You can’t display them, selling them is useless because money is useless in this game, and the only unique rewards you can get from them are those hideous outfits made by the trapper. WTF R* you couldn’t be bothered to make the legendary outfits look decent? Really? Speaking of which, outfit options in the game are so limited it’s embarrassing.

Gun shopping is fundamentally pointless as dead eye makes your beginner guns just as effective at getting headshots as upgraded guns. You’re better off just sticking with your original guns and customizing them to your liking.


What else…
The one romance Arthur has in the game is limited to 2 missions. 2.
Chapter 5 of the game should never have existed.
You don’t access a 3rd the map until the epilogue and there are no missions there when you do. I assume these regions were designed entirely for Red Dead Online.

And random events happen far too infrequently. Good luck trying to find the event where your gang busts you out of jail. I got myself imprisoned over thirty times before I got a single jailbreak scene.

Finally…
NPC interactions are a joke, especially with fellow camp members. Most go something like this:
    “Tilly!”
    “Hey Arthur”
    “Okay then, I won’t disturb you”
    “Sure Arthur”

It’s disgusting the wasted potential for interactions with fellow gang members. They built a beautiful cast and you rarely ever see or talk to most of them. R* couldn’t be bothered to make a follower system like GTA 5 where you could call up a friend and take them out for activities like drinking or robbing. So instead of taking Dutch to the Saint Denis theatre, or Karen for drinks in the local salon, or taking Sadie robbing (which would have been awesome to see), you are limited to only ever seeing them in missions. It’s pitiful.

 

 

 

TL;DR the story and acting is beyond incredible. The “living, breathing” open world we were promised, is a joke. This game was designed to be a story game, not an RPG. And they were wrong to emphasize the open world gameplay elements the way they did. It was fundamentally dishonest advertising.

That's about it. After 80+ hours I think I'm gonna take a break from the game. I love this world and these characters, but the gameplay is just too hollow to justify me running around shooting things for much longer. After the epilogue the world feels empty. Hopefully Red Dead Online will be more than the cash grab that GTA Online was. Probably not, but fingers crossed.

[Poggy]

Although I might have phrased it less harshly, I tend to agree with most of your points - many elements of the game were over-hyped and left under delivered, the economy and shopping quickly becomes almost redundant, and some of the rpg mechanics, like weight control, seem poorly implemented.

But still, it's an amazing game which I have great fun playing, and it will give me many more hours yet.  I have high hopes for online, too

[Aimesleje]

I suppose I phrased it harshly because this game means a lot to me. And I'm honestly disappointed that they half assed it. I say half assed because it perfectly describes the game. They were phenomenal half way, and left the other half basically unfinished. The game had so much wasted potential it's depressing. The characters and acting were incredible, but we barely got to interact with them. Even Dutch!

One of my favorite missions in the game was a fishing mission with Dutch and Hosea. Imagine getting intimate and unique scenes like that with all the gang members whenever you wanted just by approaching one of them and asking them to come to town with you. We could have taken any of our outlaw family hunting, drinking, watching shows, robbing... It would have strengthened our connection to these characters tenfold. The fact that R* never even considered that is embarrassing.

They gave us an amazing world and robbed us of any real connection to it.

Edited November 9, 2018 by Aimesleje

[Poggy]

Marketing = sales.  

And, maybe, to give them the benefit of the doubt, they might have tried - I do think there's a decent illusion of a moving world most of the time for the first however many hours.  Of course, the longer you play the more repetition, NPCs on tracks, and stud you see, and the illusion fades.  But it's still not bad.

Its a great game, but one with flaws, and it was overhyped.  

[Aimesleje]

2 minutes ago, Poggy said:

I do think there's a decent illusion of a moving world most of the time for the first however many hours.  Of course, the longer you play the more repetition, NPCs on tracks, and stud you see, and the illusion fades.  But it's still not bad.

Its a great game, but one with flaws, and it was overhyped.  

Illusion. Perfect description of modern open world games. The illusion of players having choice and freedom.

I have to disagree on the game being overhyped though. The story is well deserving of the hype. It's the blatant lies about the open world that gets under my skin.

[DylBandit]

6 minutes ago, Aimesleje said:

Illusion. Perfect description of modern open world games. The illusion of players having choice and freedom.

I have to disagree on the game being overhyped though. The story is well deserving of the hype. It's the blatant lies about the open world that gets under my skin.

I went into this game pretty much with an open mind, and I really enjoyed it. Rockstar has really pushed the boundaries of the Red Dead series with this title, and I really think this game delivers a lot of cool options. Some people may find all these little features not fun to use, but honestly, it's very fun for me in my own personal opinion. 

[Jayjoejohnlongsilver]

Wait, the campdeco will disappear in chapter 6? Lul why? 

I like this game a lot but I also agree to the most of your critics.

The whole choice of legendary outfits  is damn ugly.

And the camp +money system seems to be useless.

 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Jayjoejohnlongsilver

[houseofcantor]

Fair enough.

Personally do not understand the mentality that everyone must like what I like, so there's that. I don't agree with you though.

[Aimesleje]

Another complaint I have is horse bonding. The horse customization and bonding is so limited it's embarrassing. I'm betting they have a more in-depth system for Red Dead Online.

[Aimesleje]

12 hours ago, DylBandit said:

I went into this game pretty much with an open mind, and I really enjoyed it. Rockstar has really pushed the boundaries of the Red Dead series with this title, and I really think this game delivers a lot of cool options. Some people may find all these little features not fun to use, but honestly, it's very fun for me in my own personal opinion. 

Dyl, it's not about fun! It's about the quality of the product we paid for. We can all agree that it was fun. I myself praised the story and acting.

It's about the quality of the game as a whole. And to be honest, there were way to many features that were underdeveloped it's clear to see the single player was not the focus of the game. I'm willing to bet their primary revenue from this game will come from Online. Much like GTA5. We paid for a single player game and we were given an incomplete product. The "single player features" I listed above are so limited they may as well have been left out of the game entirely.

As for you, I get you're a fan, but every post you comment on you say the exact same thing. You talk about how fun the game is and ignore any complaints. So, why don't you take some of my points and refute them. Tell me how the economy in the game isn't broken. Tell me about how I'm wrong about NPC interactions. Tell me the body weight system is actually genius and way better than the body weight system in San Andreas. Stop telling me the games fun. Look at my points and refute them.

[Truth]

14 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

Good luck trying to find the event where your gang busts you out of jail.

Happened the second time I got arrested...

14 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

and hunting for perfect pelts for upgrades is a complete waste of time

Not sure if you get to keep them (I really hope you do) but the satchel upgrades are worth it in my opinion.

I feel like you need to look at the bigger picture. There's a whole world out there to explore, and tons of things to do. Some aspects are limited, but a lot of the fun comes from just exploring.

Edit: Just read the last post

9 minutes ago, Aimesleje said:

Stop telling me the games fun

IT's fun!!!

I agree with some points, but I'm nowhere near done exploring. I think that once EVERYTHING has been explored, a lot of the "unfinished" aspects would seem more complete. You might not understand the mechanics fully until that point.

Edited November 9, 2018 by Truth

[MJROu812]

Its a great game.....no JOKE?

[Aimesleje]

2 hours ago, Truth said:

Happened the second time I got arrested...

Not sure if you get to keep them (I really hope you do) but the satchel upgrades are worth it in my opinion.

I feel like you need to look at the bigger picture. There's a whole world out there to explore, and tons of things to do. Some aspects are limited, but a lot of the fun comes from just exploring.

Edit: Just read the last post

IT's fun!!!

I agree with some points, but I'm nowhere near done exploring. I think that once EVERYTHING has been explored, a lot of the "unfinished" aspects would seem more complete. You might not understand the mechanics fully until that point.

 

2 hours ago, MJROu812 said:

Its a great game.....no JOKE?

I'm not saying it's not a great game. It may be my favorite game yet. I'm saying we, as the consumers of video games, have a responsibility to our future selves to point out the things that we don't like -- because if we don't game developers are gonna keep cutting corners and creating undeveloped mechanics. And when the next great game comes around it'll be just as hollow in it's gameplay.

 

I see two types of people in these comments -- those who look at my complaints genuinely and (while they don't agree on everything) see where I'm coming from. And those, who are in the honeymoon phase of the game and can't allow themselves to even consider my point of view. Thats okay.

I've spent over 90 hours in this game now. I'm gonna go back at some point and relive the story again. It's just one of those stories I'll never stop loving. That beings said, no one can logically deny that the mechanics aren't sustainable for long term playability. There is NO economy in the game. NPCs don't really talk to you. If you guys look at the "conversation" between Arthur and Tilly that I copy pasted from my game above -- and you think that's acceptable and more than enough... Than I can't take you seriously.

Come on people, dream a little. Wouldn't it have been nice to have been able to take camp members out for activities like robbing or drinking? Get to hear conversations between them and Arthur. You CAN'T tell me that wouldn't have improved the gameplay. Almost all of the camp members we love barely get any screen time. We don't interact at all with Sadie for the first half of the game, and we don't talk with Karen for the second half. Tilly has 1 mission. Lenny has maybe 3. All of these characters have such limited screen time... And you guys are okay with that. As if you don't want more.

[MJROu812]

2 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

 

I'm not saying it's not a great game. It may be my favorite game yet. I'm saying we, as the consumers of video games, have a responsibility to our future selves to point out the things that we don't like -- because if we don't game developers are gonna keep cutting corners and creating undeveloped mechanics. And when the next great game comes around it'll be just as hollow in it's gameplay.

 

I see two types of people in these comments -- those who look at my complaints genuinely and (while they don't agree on everything) see where I'm coming from. And those, who are in the honeymoon phase of the game and can't allow themselves to even consider my point of view. Thats okay.

I've spent over 90 hours in this game now. I'm gonna go back at some point and relive the story again. It's just one of those stories I'll never stop loving. That beings said, no one can logically deny that the mechanics aren't sustainable for long term playability. There is NO economy in the game. NPCs don't really talk to you. If you guys look at the "conversation" between Arthur and Tilly that I copy pasted from my game above -- and you think that's acceptable and more than enough... Than I can't take you seriously.

Come on people, dream a little. Wouldn't it have been nice to have been able to take camp members out for activities like robbing or drinking? Get to hear conversations between them and Arthur. You CAN'T tell me that wouldn't have improved the gameplay. Almost all of the camp members we love barely get any screen time. We don't interact at all with Sadie for the first half of the game, and we don't talk with Karen for the second half. Tilly has 1 mission. Lenny has maybe 3. All of these characters have such limited screen time... And you guys are okay with that. As if you don't want more.

Ok, I agree with you on most of the things you have said, there has been  a lot of people picking the game apart of what it could have been or what it should be...Rockstar did the best they could for what the limitation the next gen consoles has, I am sure they wanted to do a lot more but couldn't, with that said I hope you enjoy your journey in RDR2. Damn I hit the wrong Quote?

Edited November 10, 2018 by MJROu812

[Gikong]

All I know is.. If you have complaints with this game then nothing can satisfy you, or you just have riddiculous standards.  This is probably the most refined game of the century.

 

Let me ask you.. which game did you think was "better" than this one? Or.. whats your all time favorite game? And finally did you think that game was perfect?

 

No games can ever satisfy everyone because everyone is different.  Its not that the game was overrated, its just not your cup of tea.

 

Given that said, this game is imo the most detailed, story driven, and captivating game that has ever been produced to date.

Name one game that you believed to be the better overall game and why. Enlighten me friend.

This game should set the standard for all gaming industries.

 

[The witcher 3 aside.. that game was awesome]

 

[DylBandit]

5 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

Dyl, it's not about fun! It's about the quality of the product we paid for. We can all agree that it was fun. I myself praised the story and acting.

It's about the quality of the game as a whole. And to be honest, there were way to many features that were underdeveloped it's clear to see the single player was not the focus of the game. I'm willing to bet their primary revenue from this game will come from Online. Much like GTA5. We paid for a single player game and we were given an incomplete product. The "single player features" I listed above are so limited they may as well have been left out of the game entirely.

As for you, I get you're a fan, but every post you comment on you say the exact same thing. You talk about how fun the game is and ignore any complaints. So, why don't you take some of my points and refute them. Tell me how the economy in the game isn't broken. Tell me about how I'm wrong about NPC interactions. Tell me the body weight system is actually genius and way better than the body weight system in San Andreas. Stop telling me the games fun. Look at my points and refute them.

Yes, I am a fan of the Red Dead series. Also, the game is very fun, I don't have to counter your opinions and viewpoints of the game, because that's honestly not my problem, and that's your opinion. I shouldn't have to counter and debate every little thing your complaining about, it's either you simply like it, or you do not like it. Are you trying to make me force you to like the game? I'm very confused...

Everyone is entitled to their very own opinion about the game, you stated your opinions, and I stated mine. 

[Aimesleje]

1 hour ago, Gikong said:

All I know is.. If you have complaints with this game then nothing can satisfy you, or you just have riddiculous standards. 

This. This right here. I literally listed my complaints and you don't even address them!

20 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

The economy is a joke
The morality system is a joke
The body weight system is a joke
The cleanliness and bath system is a joke
The side games are a joke. Games can’t be played for big bucks, even in Saint Denis
The camp is a joke!

Chores don’t get you any rewards or special dialogue, NPC’s don’t actually talk to you, and hunting for perfect pelts for upgrades is a complete waste of time because all the camp upgrades will disappear after chapter 6. (I learned that the hard way — and boy was I pissed)

And instead of going through the complaints and telling me why specific ones are wrong you just fanboy and say "if you have ANY complaints then nothing can satisfy you"

...That's absurd. Read my complaints and give me ONE specific one I'm wrong about. That's how a dialogue works. What you just did was fangirl on the internet. You didn't prove anything, you didn't debate anything. Give me a specific example of what complaints were wrong.

I swear to god. You fanboys and your inability to take criticism. I praised the game. I said it's the best I've ever played but it's got a lot of let downs. But apparently because I praised it insufficiently I deserve your scorn. 

[Aimesleje]

1 minute ago, DylBandit said:

Yes, I am a fan of the Red Dead series. Also, the game is very fun, I don't have to counter your opinions and viewpoints of the game, because that's honestly not my problem, and that's your opinion. I shouldn't have to counter and debate every little thing your complaining about, it's either you simply like it, or you do not like it. Are you trying to make me force you to like the game? I'm very confused...

Everyone is entitled to their very own opinion about the game, you stated your opinions, and I stated mine. 

I'm starting to understand it was a waste of time to talk to fanboys. I'm here trying to have a dialogue. Not change peoples mind. I LOVE the game. I've praised it. All I'm saying is that outside of the story the gameplay was unfinished. And instead of talking to me about it, you fanboys are just praising the genius of the game and telling me I don't have to like it.

You're the reason that game companies cut corners. You don't care about the quality of the product you're paying for. When they cut corners you praise it. You'll praise anything with your fanboy logo on it.

 

I've been doing this thread for months now.. But honestly, I think I'm out. Thanks guys for the good times. I'll be taking a break.

[DylBandit]

37 minutes ago, Aimesleje said:

I'm starting to understand it was a waste of time to talk to fanboys. I'm here trying to have a dialogue. Not change peoples mind. I LOVE the game. I've praised it. All I'm saying is that outside of the story the gameplay was unfinished. And instead of talking to me about it, you fanboys are just praising the genius of the game and telling me I don't have to like it.

You're the reason that game companies cut corners. You don't care about the quality of the product you're paying for. When they cut corners you praise it. You'll praise anything with your fanboy logo on it.

  

I've been doing this thread for months now.. But honestly, I think I'm out. Thanks guys for the good times. I'll be taking a break.

This forum consists of Red Dead Redemption 2 fans, as the website name clearly gives it away. However, people will respect you, unless you disrespect others. Regarding the premise of this topic, you stated your opinions, and people stated theirs without engaging hate towards your opinions. 

You then wanted people to counter your personal viewpoints of the game, which is just bound to start a war zone in the comments. I'm sure other people wouldn't like to be insulted for liking a game series. 

Knowing you been on the forum for a month, you should be very familiar with the forum rules regarding section "4" and "5": Harassment/hate posts & Bullying/trolling, which can be found here: 

https://www.rdr2.org/forums/topic/807-forum-rules/

Unfortunately, we are going to have to separate your membership, as hate speech or bullying and insulting others is NEVER tolerated here at RDR2.org either with context or intent, it does not matter. We try to keep conversations civil and friendly. 

 

[Gh0stRyder]

21 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

And they were wrong to emphasize the open world gameplay elements the way they did. It was fundamentally dishonest advertising.

Of everything you said... This stood out to be the most. They did promise a game that we didn't actually get. I am not mad, I enjoyed it for what it was but had I not been a fan of RPG games, I likely would have not enjoyed this nearly as much. I likely would have given it a bad rating. I get what you are saying with this but it isn't meant to be GTA "Old West? edition. They wanted to try something different for their games and it worked out really well. Most people are HIGHLY praising the game.

I am in no way saying you are wrong for your opinion of it, you have every right to feel how you do about the game but you have to understand that most of us on this forum aren't going to completely agree with you, or agree with you at all. 

[Truth]

10 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

I'm not saying it's not a great game. It may be my favorite game yet. I'm saying we, as the consumers of video games, have a responsibility to our future selves to point out the things that we don't like -- because if we don't game developers are gonna keep cutting corners and creating undeveloped mechanics. And when the next great game comes around it'll be just as hollow in it's gameplay.

Got it, and touche.

I understand your point. This is more of a "constructive criticism" thread than a "complaint" thread. (I'd through that in the OP for clarification, comes across like you're just complaining)

[Gikong]

7 hours ago, Aimesleje said:

This. This right here. I literally listed my complaints and you don't even address them!

And instead of going through the complaints and telling me why specific ones are wrong you just fanboy and say "if you have ANY complaints then nothing can satisfy you"

...That's absurd. Read my complaints and give me ONE specific one I'm wrong about. That's how a dialogue works. What you just did was fangirl on the internet. You didn't prove anything, you didn't debate anything. Give me a specific example of what complaints were wrong.

I swear to god. You fanboys and your inability to take criticism. I praised the game. I said it's the best I've ever played but it's got a lot of let downs. But apparently because I praised it insufficiently I deserve your scorn. 

Thought you wanted roasting..