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I must have missed the historic part of the battle of Wounded Knee when Custer was shot in the back of the head by a varmint rifle when exiting a cutscene.

I think people going out of their way to attack someone who is clearly minding their own business is a little immature, but still within the parameters of the game... It used to bother me more, but now that I am ranked a little higher and am a little better shooting-wise, I usually have the situational awareness to “handle” the issue before they get at me.

That's because people that don't like pvp see pvp as griefing. They want matched only pvp. If they didn't want to be killed in a game or the risk of, then play a pve game. I know the pve bunnies from hell are gonna rain down on me, but no one forcing you to play. And if there are other games that pull off the toggle pvp or whatever to "please everyone" and WANT to do that, then go play them then.

I'm not usually bothered by this stuff, but sh*t like that makes me question why I play multiplayer games. I know y'all wanna play how you want, but there's a fine line you cross when you go way out of your way to harass someone when they obviously don't want to be bothered. Yeah I could have parley, I forget that's a thing cuz I don't usually run across people that disgustingly persistent. Like do you have nothing better to do?

My name is Mason N. from Pekin, Illinois and im 24 and i have a child who is 9. Yes i had a child at 14, and im a pretty casual gamer. I play Rainbow six siege, Red Dead Redemption 2, Gta and a lot of others. Add me on Playstation at SnailZ321.

Purely situational. If you're shot in the back of the head coming out of an interaction lock (like a cutscene) or someone is using an exploit to circumvent the system as intended and kill you without being killed themselves, then yes, that meets the qualifications to be labeled a "griefer". Killing people whom are not actively engaging in PvP playstyle and are just minding their own business are ostensibly being targeted just be aggrived by the offending party. Hence the term "Griefer". PK'ers is inclusive of legitimate activities as designed by the game. "Griefing" or "Griefers", as stated above, are labeled as such when the sole driving force for the action of PK'ing is meant to aggrieve another player--hence "situational" labels, as I said. Not true. I'm an avowed "PvE Bunny" because of my diminished skills brought on by advanced age and chronic alcoholism, but I understand the sentiment and have no desire to rain down. I will say that it seems disproportionate to have TWO dedicated PvP play modes (Showdown and Gun Rush) but ZERO PvE dedicated zones. Free Roam should give players who want a more genteel experience that option if they so desire. Me personally? I'm just sick of spawning in and being headshot within fifteen seconds by some delta bravo with nothing better to do than harass other players. It's cherry picking. If they wanted a REAL challenge, they'd go up against people who were prepared for them in a Showdown Series or Gun Rush game, as opposed to being a yellow-bellied, cake-eating, candy-ass, wuss who shoots people in the back of the head or from afar who's 100+ levels lower than them in progression. Having a toggle does nothing to diminish anyone's enjoyment of the game, apart from these human sacks of road apples. Not trying to argue, but I do not seem to recall any claims by R* promising PvE gameplay. I could be wrong, but that's just my recollection of the marketing. I'd also argue that the game being in "beta" gives them a level of protection against claims that they have yet to deliver what you are alleging they have promised. But Griefers are still Delta Bravos, regardless of what was advertised. Then Uncle Bropollo walks across the street in ten days for The Division 2. Though to be fair, what I want is to have the game be playable--the recent update has exacerbated the disconnect issue and created innumerable interaction locks--every time I open my catalog, and about half the time I open a store owner's catalog, I get locked into it and all I can do is zoom in or out (Literally have to restart). When matchmaking in Free Roam for missions, the lobby has an interaction lock that won't start the mission--it prevents people from "readying up" or the timer from counting down--even in full lobbies. The PvE PvP thing is tiresome but it's far from the most pressing issue they have. They need to stabilize this thing. Badly. Does my definition meet your requirements? We can make it a forum rule! Like not releasing this hot mess to begin with. They should have waited, clearly, because updates have made things progressively worse overall, not better, especially from a performance perspective. I really wish someone from R* would explain to us just exactly why they felt AA was a necessity out of the box. I get it for, say, Free Roam, because shooting rats and chipmunks from horseback to finish daily quests is quite ridiculous. But having it in SHowdown and Gun Rush? "Pure Garbage" isn't harsh enough a term.

I don't like to use the term griefer. They are player killers. PKers. https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pker Grief is just a reaction from being killed by a Pker that some people have. So they call them 'griefers'. Pkers are an assorted bag of player mentalities. Some are assholes, some are di*ks, some are pussies and some are just fooling around.

Again, it comes back to what Rockstar wants in their game. If you kill me and it was unprovoked, I view that as griefing. What I'm hearing from some is that "It's okay if they kill you once, as long as they don't KEEP killing you." To me, it's griefing if you do it once. You feel that someone should have to "even ask me to leave them be"? (Though you said "ask" I initially typed "beg" instead of "ask" because I pretty much see that as the same thing.) Sorry, I don't think that's appropriate. But Rockstar needs to be clearer about what their game is to be. I certainly didn't buy a game where I considered a "fun and fair environment" would be one where I would have to beg--sorry, ask--for someone not to shoot me when I'm minding my own business. There are plenty of games that manage to easily accomplish this and they've done it for years. Again, it goes back to Rockstar being honest about what this game/beta is supposed to be.

sorry, forgot attachment

Good idea.

There is obviously confusion here and it's being caused by Rockstar. All they would have to do is say, our game allows griefing. Period. Then I would personally have nothing to report. But Rockstar didn't do that. They keep saying,"we are going to implement anti griefing measures." So something supposedly allowed in the game by design is supposedly being curtailed by them (well, at least that's what they say--I don't believe it). My point is, you either want to allow griefing or you don't. If you want to allow it, stop all the lies and just admit it. If you want to stop it, put some measures in with some real teeth. Rockstar needs to be honest, just like that other Wild West game, just like Black Desert Online. That's my problem with them right now. I'm sending in my last bit of feedback either today or tomorrow (describing how I've still been attacked while minding my own business). I sometimes submitted two or three a a day before the update, explaining how I was getting spawn killed or sniped while fishing or on the way to the butcher and included player names (I had already reported and blocked them). After the update, I find their new anti griefing methods to be a joke and I've decided I'm not going to keep sending in feedback with my complaints about this because I almost feel like I'm begging. I'll still log on to do the quick missions which I do enjoy (why did they take one away?!?! They need to add more!!) or hope for the occasional solo lobby glitch but as far as me leisurely roaming and hunting and fishing (which I say their promotional materials said I was going to be able to do), I'm pretty much done with it in the shape the game is right now. Sorry, but having to sneak around a game to avoid other players isn't the way my time should be spent.

They should change the color of the set waypoint marker (yellow maybe?) With the new bounty system, in some sessions I'm seeing a lot of red indicators in my hud.

Regarding inquiries about animal carcass sales after Title Update 1.06 in the Red Dead Online Beta:

Im a pve player and if a kid bothers me i go to another sandbox or fight back depending on my mood. Simpel as that exept there will be no more fighting until they redo that stupid bounty system. Now i parley and move on with my buissnes not loosing anyhing on my horse etc so its real lame if you ask me. I want a little exitement but we are all different. I really did not se the problem from the start is what i am trying to say but hey thats me 🤗

not gonna get into details but yes people need to stop using the word "griefer" so loosely.

Any Metallica, 82-86

Oh snaps ! Paging Dr @BropolloCreed79 it's getting heated in here ! Lol

So I was on last night a bit trying to grind up some money and xp via collecting herbs pretty much minding my own business and all was good. I come down out of the hills north of emerald station and veered east in order to avoid a known hazard area of emerald station to go to a fishing hole I like. I saw a blue dot on mini map and went opposite direction but couldn't loose him. Then three more appears from direction I am going to so I changed directions again. By the time I was almost to Blackwater these clowns were still on my ass. I looked at player list and they were from level 200 to 85 and I am 29. So as I was thinking to myself that I am actually paying to be harassed like this I decided to log after blocking them of coarse. The point I am trying to make here is that this is not fun at this point and I am really tired of other people ruining my game for me. I mean come on guys what kind of challenge is that. R* has the coding in place to make the game fun for all by adding invite only sessions but they refuse to implement it. I think all you people should be able to play the game the way you like and that includes those that choose to be back shooters and those like myself that want to play with friends that have the same play styles. I like a good shoot em up as well as the next but to run around in constant chaos is not what I bought into. For me it is time to shelf this one for maybe a later date. I will be playing from time to time when I see friends on but as a solo player I think I am done. Hmm maybe go to Division for awhile dunno.....

I hit "eject disc" and restart until I land somewhere without pew pew pond scum. Life's too short to waste in the company of dorks. Even the parlay thing means giving them more attention than they are worth.

Yes my son does game with me.

Yeah. I haven’t noticed any butcher thievery since the update. I quite easily made enough money to buy the rare shotgun I wanted (actually, I wanted the standard double barrel, but this one doesn’t have a level requirement). My only regret is not farming cops for a day or two before the update... however I’m considering an experiment in farming bounty hunters... has anyone noticed if you rack up more bounty fighting off the bounty hunters?

hell yeah Kean_1... gators are easy pickings for big game meat with a rifle head shot... heron, spoonbill, pelican and loon plumes... deer, boars, toads and muskrats also but not as often... plus a couple of quality fishing spots... and then you can head to van horn, take cover on the pier behind the fence and go to town on NPC's and lawmen

It's especially nice now that we're getting paid for all the pelts.

You can make A lot more money selling the parts and pelts from a half dozen deer and one carcass/whole animal than hauling them to the butcher one at a time... at least as far as dollars for a half hour time goes. At least from what I’ve noticed, your experience may differ. I also tend to shoot everything that walks, crawls, slithers or flys when I’m riding around... 30 cents is 30 cents after all.

I noticed 3* gators dropping 5 cuts of big game meat also.

same here Kean_1... and of course, the east coast in between st. denis and van horn trading post

I prefer the cross map method myself... spawn in at Blackwater or something then zig zag cross country from butcher to butcher, killing everything that moves... maybe not the most effective use of my time, but I enjoy the scenery. Also, I tend to go for quantity over quality. If I see a perfect buck I’ll make the effort to keep it that way of course. But I like to start seeing the ‘you can’t take any more parts’ messages before I get to the next sell point. since the update, I have had one bad day where animals seemed to disappear. But today was back to normal for me.

I'd tell ya but then I'd have to shoot ya. Seriously though, it's no secret. I personally like Big Valley but I also have success in areas like the plains of the Heartlands, etc. I usually just go to a spot and run back and forth over a distance that will allow animals to respawn.

So much for lack of griefing. You stay bright red to griefers for a super long time and they can just follow the red glow and find you. One did earlier when they waited 15mins for me to finish a mission, then killed me as soon as I got out of the cutscene. They called it pvp, I told them it aint pvp if you just waitin to shoot someone in the back. I went back and blew them all up and two chased me from Rhodes all the way out to manzanita in tall trees. I fast traveled and thought that was the end of it, that's why I didn't parley, but they followed me twice. And it's shitty that when someone shoots at you, they only stay red for a couple minutes sometimes allowing them to go out of range then shoot at you again, but these guys stayed red for like 15mins or so.

That reply was nearly 3 months ago but taking his response in the original context of the discussion, yes, it is a valid report. There is a report feature in the game and R* has specifically listed "disruptive behavior" which this clearly is. They have also made a correlation between indiscriminate killing and "griefing" since then.

Sounds good to me. I like it.

There's some results in the that, as a parent, I wouldn't want to be explaining to my 8 year old son. The Kieran scene is pretty bad, though, as is the whole "burning bodies" thing. It's going to depend on the parent and kid. My kids are too young for RDR2 in ANY capacity (they're 8 and 5), so I don't even play it unless they're in bed for the night. The lynched people hanging from the trees in Lemyone isn't ideal for kids either, imo. Even the O'Driscolls and Mrs. Adler in the beginning might lead to questions you don't want to answer, depending on the age of you kids. There's also the whole "guy with a pig" thing. Not trying to sound like a prude, but depending on the kid, again, I'd be hesitant to have them stumble across that as well.

Now if only they could allow female characters to have.... boobs. I'm no guy, but I do wish my character had a couple bra sizes on her instead of looking like a really feminine man with a nice butt.

@Voss, Since you asked, here's the list:

Lol now I feel like a giant numpty lmao thanks guys

Yes, I know what you're saying. Going to the butcher should almost be something mundane. Might be easier looking for treasure in Lagras with all the gators! LOL

Because sometimes you just wanted get rid of that pre adolescent who comes on the mic squeeking out profanity and racial slurs and trying to act all gangster while his mom is yelling at him in the background to pick up his toys... I mean sure there is mute, but they don’t learn anything that way.