Online Mode Is An Unskilled Broken Mess.

[Kean_1]

33 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

The free aim and movement is a bit clunky,  I won't argue that.  But most shooters are too over simplified in the 1st place and have spoiled players on how shooting should be.

Most are, I agree.  Have to play on PC to get any that are really any good IMO but then they are considered too "milsim" by the masses.  If I was still building PCs I would be playing a lot of those games that you just can't find on console.  ....or come around way too rarely.  

GRW had a good "feel" to me and wasn't over-simplified IMO by comparison (for a console game).  I also liked that you could ADS and clear rooms properly, etc. I liked the cover system and ability to go prone.  Enemies were lethal but so was the player.  Too bad the butchered the PvP mode by increasing the TTK, adding special abilities and all the other crap that makes me hate games like CoD.  They wanted to appeal to the masses.

Personally, I can't wait for Insurgency Sandstorm later this year.  Realistic reloads, animations and a lethal damage model.  About as close as we've had to a milsim title or good tactical shooter on console in a long time.  I also hear that they will likely not have any AA option at all but that has yet to be seen. 

 

33 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

Anyone whos ever shot a real gun in real life and moved around while doing it.  You're not just gonna move around twitch shooting everything that moves, that's now how things work.  

In RD..  The auto aim is too accurate. 

I don't think anyone here has made the argument that auto aim or RDO is anything like shooting in real life. The shooting and overall weapon handling / mechanics in RDR2 or GTA for that matter are very arcadey IMO which is a big part of the reason why I just use AA in these games.  

I do agree AA is too overpowered which is why I mentioned that I scale it way back.  I'm not happy with AA but I'm also not happy with the way the mechanics are without it.  For me, AA simply doesn't bother me as much as the clunky mechanics do in free aim.

.......and yeah, you can say I've fired weapons in "real life" and even own a few.   

 

56 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

In pvp it turns into ability cards or diving around.  Because every time someone presses LT they lock on.  Theres no real thrill in it.

......kinda the reason I don't play PvP modes in this game.  Way too arcadey for me.  Big reason I don't play other PvP shooters either where players can bunny hop around, etc.

 

56 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

PVE..   30 NPCS are nothing but auto aim fodder.  The only way to die is to get so far deep into NPCs line of sight, that you can't auto aim fast enough.  It makes things extremely boring.

....boring for you but not for me.  I found a decent compromise turning down the AA as far as I can.  Again, that's not to say I like AA but I also don't like the way the gunplay feels in free aim (in this game). 

As I said before, it's simply feels too unnatural to me.  .......nothing to do with being not easy enough, it just feels clunky.  GRW felt good by comparison and more natural as it would in real life.  .....relatively speaking. 

 

56 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

The best part about free aim..  Even if its a bit clunky.  Is that shoot outs become more exciting when you don't expect every single shot to land on every target close to you, just because you pressed LT.

RDO has great gin mechanics..  Spoiled by auto aim.

Hell,  I dare anyone here to round up 4 people and play the co-op missions with free aim and no ability cards slotted.  Pretend auto aim doesn't exist..   And I bet you'll have the most fun you've ever had in terms of pve.

 

I will agree with you there.  Free aim would change the dynamic in RDO.  ....for the better IMO.  However, I don't know how much I would like living with free aim in this game the way it is now.  If they ever do come out with the mode, I will be trying it though.

 

[Diss]

I've not been on this forum for a few weeks, or played RDR2 online for even longer, I've just dropped in to see whether R* have finally started to listen and act upon  the feedback from people who are being griefed. 

 

I see we still have the 'join another lobby' brigade who think that players who just want to play their game in peace should move on , rather than anything being done to stop the griefers wrecking other people's games in the first place. Seems R* are still happy with this state of affairs. 

[lumper]

On 4/25/2019 at 8:48 AM, Renascent said:

So you basically don't want to have to look out for yourself? I mean God forbid that you have to plan a route to the butcher or whatever.

I've only ever been killed twice at the butcher because I'm not dumb enough to just run straight in expecting people to be nice and honorable. It's the wild West, even they were wary back then. Rockstar effectively created that feeling.

It's not that at all, ok, I always plan a route to take me away from noobs and people who just shoot at everyone they come across, its more getting to the butcher and then being killed before you can engage the butcher, because these people tend to congregate around towns again because everything is about them and that is where the most people are at times, since they have to come to town for various things, it just sucks to be in a grind and not want to deal with it right now and be brought into someone else fight.

That is the other thing, its not 100% of the time, it is after I have had enough, I have been grinding for hours literally, 6 or 7 hours I just want to get to the butcher one more time, so I can go to my camp and then purchase a fast travel post let's say, so at that point, I just want to be left alone, im tired, ive already dealt with a dozen morons and griefers, people following me, shooting at me, etc.. 

Lastly, whether you agree or disagree, they are implementing a system to prevent this behavior because so many people feel the same way, they dont want to be forced to play your way, they want to play the game anyway they want, and as long as they arent upsetting other people they should be able to able to.

Many griefers and trolls say "Hey I am just playing the game the way I want too", but they arent allowing others to play the way they want too, then when they are told this they criticize others, as if their way is the only way, and this selfish attitude and terrible sense of not respecting other people is what ruins everything with online games.

I really enjoy when I run into a player and they arent douches, I have met many cool people while free roaming, we talked, shared some stuff, sometimes teamed up, etc.. it is interesting to hear from other players who are out there, I think it is more fun to get to know your neighbor than just shoot them, and it is easy enough to find action, as others have said, you can get involved in ANY stranger mission, so there are tons of those, and there are alot of people that also want to shoot so it is easy enough to find them and start shooting and leave the butcher area alone.

Peopel get bored, it is too much work to grind, I look at these peoples profiles, they usually have all their cards maxed out, they dont grind, they just come in, shoot it up, look for something THEY consider fun and then leave, many of us on the other hand work very hard to grind these levels so we can get to a point that makes us the most effective in pvp and missions, and it is during these long, hard grinds that I personally dont want to be bothered.

[Netnow66]

22 minutes ago, Diss said:

I've not been on this forum for a few weeks, or played RDR2 online for even longer, I've just dropped in to see whether R* have finally started to listen and act upon  the feedback from people who are being griefed. 

 

I see we still have the 'join another lobby' brigade who think that players who just want to play their game in peace should move on , rather than anything being done to stop the griefers wrecking other people's games in the first place. Seems R* are still happy with this state of affairs. 

Most I know are waiting for the offensive/defensive update to drop.

Others, such as myself, are content playing in solo/passive lobbies when we bother to log in--which isn't very often for me.

[HuDawg]

5 minutes ago, lumper said:

Many griefers and trolls say "Hey I am just playing the game the way I want too", but they arent allowing others to play the way they want too

Well, this is a wild west game..  

 

The reality is..  Its R* that's not allowing players to play the way they want.    

6 months later.  Still no private/invite only lobbies.

 

[Darkvicar]

Are solo/passive lobbies a thing or a glitch/ just empty lobby?

[Kean_1]

1 hour ago, Darkvicar said:

Are solo/passive lobbies a thing or a glitch/ just empty lobby?

It's not on purpose but it does happen from time to time I've noticed.

[HuDawg]

On ‎5‎/‎3‎/‎2019 at 10:38 AM, Diss said:

I see we still have the 'join another lobby' brigade who think that players who just want to play their game in peace should move on , rather than anything being done to stop the griefers wrecking other people's games in the first place. 

The only thing that needs to be done is to add invite/private lobbies, since this is the ONLY way to stop other people from 'wrecking' your game.

Anything else that's done will only ruin the entire game.  Since griefers are mostly playing as intended.

 

Currently you have two options.  Join another lobby or shoot back.   Realistically, no one should be playing in peace in public games.

[Madrigalian]

On 4/27/2019 at 9:04 AM, HuDawg said:

This makes no sense..

You like auto aim?    And you play for immersion?      Auto aim breaks immersion.     Especially when combined with ability cards..

Its got nothing to do with skill..   

Auto aim makes the game brain dead stupid on every front.. From PVP to PVE.   RD is a shooter.

Playing a 'true free aim pvp game'?  Well if RD had free aim, it would be a true free aim pvp game.

 

HuDawg, you have effectively summed up the differences between you and I and why you seem confused by my statement.  I am not playing RDO as a shooter.   

I bought RDR2 to play a western.  To enjoy an old west setting with old west plot themes, stories, characters and events.  RDR2 was not a shooter.  It was/is a story based, single player, mission driven, immersion into the trials and troubles of being a bandit on the run in the old west.  This is what I played to 100% completion in the single player mode and what I want to continue to play in a shared online world with folks who share my love of old west tropes.

I am not playing RDO to run around shooting everything that moves or player that crosses my path.  If I want to do that, I will join a PVP event (make those free aim, I don't care)  but I rarely do join such events because I find them boring and not at all immersive in terms of experiencing an old west online world.  I don't personally recall events in the old days were men and women were encouraged to shoot, dynamite, and kill one another for sport.  Maybe I just missed those tales. /shrug

Like I said in a previous comment, I like PVP.  I enjoy PVP aspects of the game and enjoy the free roam dangers that an open PVP world allows.  But that doesn't mean I play this game to PVP.  I play this game for the western tropes, the missions, the immersion of riding, hunting, fishing, making friends, making enemies, and generally playing and leveling up a cool western character in a cool western world.  Making the game more PVP centric simply does not interest me, much.

I would much rather R* focus on more missions, more cooperative events, more free roam events, more random encounters, more NPC characters and interactions, more reasons to Hunt and Craft,  more reasons to use your camp and defend it, continuing to fix bugs, etc, etc.

If I wanted to play a straight up shooter game, I have better games to choose from.  That's not what I play RDO for. 

Obviously, I may be in the minority.  But that's OK.  I paid in, so I'm entitled to share my mind as well.  YMMV.

    

 

 

 

[jnaron_ngc]

On 4/25/2019 at 7:48 AM, James Hickok_1837 said:

And finally even if You get killed and loose some pelts or a fish the game doesnt punish You for that. You dont loose your guns, you dont loose exp, you dont loose money. You just spawn near the point were you were killed. The pelts or game lost can be farmed fast. Its not that you loose weeks or even months of play upon death like the games i used to play.    Its E-Z. 

I remember Ultima Online, you lost everything when you died.

[Madrigalian]

6 minutes ago, jnaron_ngc said:

I remember Ultima Online, you lost everything when you died.

Me too!

I remember Everquest where if you died you had a long and naked trek back to the zone where you died, to "try" and sneak back to your corpse, which was now camped by the monsters that already beat you when you had armor and weapons, just to try and get your stuff back.  This usually did not end well, of course. 

Oh, and by dying, you lost xp and could actually de-level yourself in the process!

Ah, fun times. 

Edited May 6, 2019 by Madrigalian

[DNMNetTech]

3 minutes ago, Madrigalian said:

Me too!

I remember Everquest where if you died you had a long and naked trek back to the zone where you died, to "try" and sneak back to your corpse, which was now camped by the monsters that already beat you when you had armor and weapons, just to try and get your stuff back.  This usually did not end well, of course. 

Oh, and by dying, you lost xp and could actually de-level yourself in the process!

Ah, fun times. 

Many old school gamers that played eve, everquest, asherons call etc. know about grinding and loss related to dying. This is definitely a result of every kid getting a trophy IMO. Everyone wants it and wants it now with no consequences for losing. Cheese anyone?

[HuDawg]

4 hours ago, Madrigalian said:

HuDawg, you have effectively summed up the differences between you and I and why you seem confused by my statement.  I am not playing RDO as a shooter.   

I bought RDR2 to play a western.  To enjoy an old west setting with old west plot themes, stories, characters and events.  RDR2 was not a shooter.  It was/is a story based, single player, mission driven, immersion into the trials and troubles of being a bandit on the run in the old west.  This is what I played to 100% completion in the single player mode and what I want to continue to play in a shared online world with folks who share my love of old west tropes.

I am not playing RDO to run around shooting everything that moves or player that crosses my path.  If I want to do that, I will join a PVP event (make those free aim, I don't care)  but I rarely do join such events because I find them boring and not at all immersive in terms of experiencing an old west online world.  

   

Its really got nothing to do with pvp.  And I totally understand if you don't want to pvp. Its not for everyone. Which is why this game needs private lobbies for people to easily find role players and other like minded players to play with.  Public games are filled with all kinds of wackos..

My main point was about shooting and immersion.   And when you brought up immersion, I just rolled with it.  Because auto aim does suck the immersion right of shooting. (among other things)

And the end of the day, one of Red Dead main game play mechanics is shooting.   And auto aim ruins shooting.

 

For pvp folks..  Auto aim + Ability cards.+Tonic Chugging'.  Has pretty much killed off any real competitive pvp from even happening.  People just pvp to rank up quick/earn money.  

Co-op missions are more of a feeding frenzy with 4 players munching down auto aim kills.  Which is just not exciting..

And of course..  theres hunting.  Say what you will, but try hunting with free aim for a while and tell me that doesn't feel more immersive.  Its an entirely different game.

Edited May 6, 2019 by HuDawg

[Netnow66]

9 hours ago, Madrigalian said:

HuDawg, you have effectively summed up the differences between you and I and why you seem confused by my statement.  I am not playing RDO as a shooter.   

I bought RDR2 to play a western.  To enjoy an old west setting with old west plot themes, stories, characters and events.  RDR2 was not a shooter.  It was/is a story based, single player, mission driven, immersion into the trials and troubles of being a bandit on the run in the old west.  This is what I played to 100% completion in the single player mode and what I want to continue to play in a shared online world with folks who share my love of old west tropes.

I am not playing RDO to run around shooting everything that moves or player that crosses my path.  If I want to do that, I will join a PVP event (make those free aim, I don't care)  but I rarely do join such events because I find them boring and not at all immersive in terms of experiencing an old west online world.  I don't personally recall events in the old days were men and women were encouraged to shoot, dynamite, and kill one another for sport.  Maybe I just missed those tales. /shrug

Like I said in a previous comment, I like PVP.  I enjoy PVP aspects of the game and enjoy the free roam dangers that an open PVP world allows.  But that doesn't mean I play this game to PVP.  I play this game for the western tropes, the missions, the immersion of riding, hunting, fishing, making friends, making enemies, and generally playing and leveling up a cool western character in a cool western world.  Making the game more PVP centric simply does not interest me, much.

I would much rather R* focus on more missions, more cooperative events, more free roam events, more random encounters, more NPC characters and interactions, more reasons to Hunt and Craft,  more reasons to use your camp and defend it, continuing to fix bugs, etc, etc.

If I wanted to play a straight up shooter game, I have better games to choose from.  That's not what I play RDO for. 

Obviously, I may be in the minority.  But that's OK.  I paid in, so I'm entitled to share my mind as well.  YMMV.

 

Very nicely put. I agree with about 99% of what you wrote. 

And, for me personally, a game that is so full and rich with content is wasted if played as a shooter. As you said, there are other games that fit the bill.

[Cliffs]

I read a few times players want to play THEIR way....well griefers want to play their way, right?

[DNMNetTech]

1 hour ago, Cliffs said:

I read a few times players want to play THEIR way....well griefers want to play their way, right?

Nailed it!

[Netnow66]

1 hour ago, Cliffs said:

I read a few times players want to play THEIR way....well griefers want to play their way, right?

Yes but, just as in real life, bullying isn't tolerated, at least by civilized people.

[Jackalope_Jill]

Haha, imagine if they made an option for just female players, FvF. Everyone would be so catty and butt-holes to each other. That, or we'd all pick herbs and talk smack over the mic. 

Seriously though, I definitely agree with private lobbies, or environments where you're just allowed to fish, or hunt, I dunno... 

Edited May 8, 2019 by Jackalope_Jill

[Goonersoldier]

After GTAV Online came out, I quit a month after playing. Same with RDR2 Online. It's quite simple really. Griefing = No skills. Brainless CHILDISH Gameplay. This is the #1 Reason why RDR2 Online Beta was a massive FAIL. Mark my words. Rockstar online gaming will continue to go downhill until they add an OPTION for gamers that don't childish brainless garbage. The solution is SIMPLE and even little kid like games have this mechanic in their games. ENEMY PLAYER BLIPS OFF + Auto Aim off. Imagine a World of GTAV and RDR2 online with this system in place. 1)Would be an option so Griefers can keep their servers but I doubt anyone would play there. 2) add a new dimension of skills to the Gameplay tactics: Stealth, strategy, etc. 3) Proximity chat or something similar would be ideal and eliminate the idea of ghost towns these Griefers cry about. 4) Many online players would come back, stay on, or enjoy the game alot more.   It really is that easy to fix and would give the Rockstar online community a better online rep. Its considered the most toxic online experience due to Rockstars inability to adjust to online gaming.  Till than, guess me and thousands of others will never see ya online. Enjoy the brainless Gameplay online. 

[Goonersoldier]

On 5/3/2019 at 10:38 AM, Diss said:

I've not been on this forum for a few weeks, or played RDR2 online for even longer, I've just dropped in to see whether R* have finally started to listen and act upon  the feedback from people who are being griefed. 

 

I see we still have the 'join another lobby' brigade who think that players who just want to play their game in peace should move on , rather than anything being done to stop the griefers wrecking other people's games in the first place. Seems R* are still happy with this state of affairs. 

Agreed 100%. The solution is easy. Create servers with enemy player blips off. I guarantee no one would be upset about getting killed while fishing, hunting, selling meats, etc.. You leave voice chat or proximity chat on so it doesn't feel like a ghost town. There would be no need for private/ solo lobbies. Why can a game like Fortnite do this but Rockstar can't? Go on YouTube and you'll see GTA online has mods with this exact gameplay and it is absolutely Brilliant. Guess it's true Rockstar only wants to cater to casual gamers. 

[James Hickok_1837]

11 hours ago, Goonersoldier said:

 Enjoy the brainless Gameplay online. 

I understand that you dont like the game or the state its in currently but please dont insult the ppl that are playing and enjoying the game. Thank You.  

[DNMNetTech]

Well! If you don't like the game or game state, don't play it. I do have some wonderful diamond back 10 year old cheese!!

[Bucnation3139]

14 hours ago, Goonersoldier said:

After GTAV Online came out, I quit a month after playing. Same with RDR2 Online. It's quite simple really. Griefing = No skills. Brainless CHILDISH Gameplay. This is the #1 Reason why RDR2 Online Beta was a massive FAIL. Mark my words. Rockstar online gaming will continue to go downhill until they add an OPTION for gamers that don't childish brainless garbage. The solution is SIMPLE and even little kid like games have this mechanic in their games. ENEMY PLAYER BLIPS OFF + Auto Aim off. Imagine a World of GTAV and RDR2 online with this system in place. 1)Would be an option so Griefers can keep their servers but I doubt anyone would play there. 2) add a new dimension of skills to the Gameplay tactics: Stealth, strategy, etc. 3) Proximity chat or something similar would be ideal and eliminate the idea of ghost towns these Griefers cry about. 4) Many online players would come back, stay on, or enjoy the game alot more.   It really is that easy to fix and would give the Rockstar online community a better online rep. Its considered the most toxic online experience due to Rockstars inability to adjust to online gaming.  Till than, guess me and thousands of others will never see ya online. Enjoy the brainless Gameplay online. 

You take care now ! 

Edited May 9, 2019 by Chris Arbaugh
(removed blank lines from end of post)

[Goonersoldier]

FYI. Don't mean to insult any of you so apologies. I put 100% of the blame on *Rockstar. It really is such a simple option to implement into the game. 

[Kean_1]

1 hour ago, Goonersoldier said:

FYI. Don't mean to insult any of you so apologies. I put 100% of the blame on *Rockstar. It really is such a simple option to implement into the game. 

Sharing your ideas, concerns, suggestions, etc. is fine.  Please remember though that this is a fan site and not affiliated with R* or 2K in any way.  .....so your audience is essentially all of us here, the RDR2.org community.  

I think some folks just felt put off by your general remarks about the player base.  Fact is, although you may have given up on the game, there are still those who enjoy playing it, are looking forward to more updates, like the direction it's going, etc.  There's nothing wrong with that nor are opposing opinions. 

I do appreciate you reaching out to tell those offended there's no hard feelings.  Thanks for that.